You bring up some really important considerations that I hadn't even thought about, like who gets to decide. Given how often in human history some entitled jackass believes they get to decide unilaterally, I'm with you, this is a good bill to pass.
I was thinking that it was the oil/gas people that wanted to research seeding as a way to deal with climate change induced drought so they wouldn’t have to do anything about it themselves.
I typed a long comment, but it was eaten by poor wifi. Suffice it to say Three Mile Island does not belong on the same list as BP or even Chernobyl; nobody was harmed, and the incident resulted in sweeping regulatory changes (as did Chernobyl, even though that couldn't happen for technical reasons even if we managed to form a government as malicious and incompetent as the Soviets had in 1986).
Speaking of the "thermostat" topic, I feel like I should point out that there's basically a "=" between "cold northern climates" and "wealthy Western nations" - the exceptions amount to like Russia and Greenland and caveats are still needed for both.
Also, as a Finn let me tell you we're not actually super happy about global warming up here. The rising temperatures are already causing all *kinds* of issues large and small and even the most uninformed urbanite is at least vaguely aware that the summers are really starting to get unpleasantly hot and proper snowy winters an increasingly rare beast.
And if the really bad feedback loops like serious polar ice retreat (potentially leading to the Gulf Stream going titsup), Arctic permafrost thaw (releasing stupid amounts of trapped CO2 and methane and whatnot) and what have you start kicking in?
Ain't nobody having fun *anywhere*, inclusive the short-sighted nitwits presently ecstatic over the prospects of commercially navigable Northwest and Northeat Passages, and the postglacial rebound of our Nordic coastlines sure as heck isn't going to outpace the rising sea levels.
I love your work. Having said that, I don’t love this piece. You decry one thing, cloud seeding to stimulate rainfall into drought-stricken areas, and then, to support your trepidation around using that process, you talk about something completely different, reflecting heat back into space to alleviate warming.
Ooooh no, I don't have a problem with cloud seeding for rain, although there's no real evidence it works consistently (boooo!). And even though MTG is using that as a red herring, that's not really what she's talking about in her bill.
Remember, Republicans deny climate change even exists and therefore deny that we need to address it in any way. Florida has made it illegal to even pass laws to have mitigation efforts. That's what MTG is doing here, although in this case, she happens to be right but for the wrong reasons.
Cloud seeding for rain is small-scale and local. MTG is explicitly talking about climate-level efforts, which cloud seeding for rain is not. Although I understand what you're saying.
Ok. The segue from cloud seeding to more elaborate and fraught forms of geoengineering like the “space mirrors” wasn’t evident to me on first read. BTW we probably have effective space mirrors coming anyway with the space Nazi’s (and others entering that area) surveillance satellites. As always, the south african “genius” is probably taking a hammer to his own dick by short circuiting his impossible mars colony dream (no gravitational field=no atmosphere = no colony), assuming he could get his big boy rockets to not blow up on the pad, by creating so much orbital debris that nothing can get into space anyway. On 2nd thought, he probably doesn’t care as he’ll get paid anyway. Carry on with the god’s work you’re doing!
The rich irony is this: The fossil fuel industry (coal, petroleum, etc.) have been "geoengineering" for centuries, but without acknowledging it. Every ton of fossil fuel that is burned injects an exponentially greater amount of greenhouse gasses and particulate into the atmosphere.
As MTG so astutely observes, that "injection, release, or dispersion of chemicals and substances into the atmosphere" is exactly the problem, however it is not a matter of "cloud seeding", it is just business as usual. The only missing factor is an announcement of an "express purpose of altering weather, temperature, climate, or sunlight intensity."
Frankly, if one operates machinery or equipment in a manner that a reasonable person should have known is likely to cause harm, even if not intending the harm, that person may be legally liable for the unintended outcome.
Will the purveyors and promoters of fossil fuels be locked up if MTG's fantasy makes their emissions a felony?
You bring up some really important considerations that I hadn't even thought about, like who gets to decide. Given how often in human history some entitled jackass believes they get to decide unilaterally, I'm with you, this is a good bill to pass.
I was sooooo mad when I read that. It was so obvious, but did it occur to me? No. -_-
I was thinking that it was the oil/gas people that wanted to research seeding as a way to deal with climate change induced drought so they wouldn’t have to do anything about it themselves.
I thought it was just me.
I'm so relieved.
Agreeing with her made me gaslight myself. (Have I gone nuts? Did I lose a bunch of IQ points?)
I don't believe we have the control or understanding to make geo-engineering any kind of good idea. I,m considering:
Three Mile Island
Thalidomide
Chernobyl
British Petroleum
The Titanic
The promoters of these technologies THINK their ship can't sink. It's terrifying.
Thanks for the validation.
I typed a long comment, but it was eaten by poor wifi. Suffice it to say Three Mile Island does not belong on the same list as BP or even Chernobyl; nobody was harmed, and the incident resulted in sweeping regulatory changes (as did Chernobyl, even though that couldn't happen for technical reasons even if we managed to form a government as malicious and incompetent as the Soviets had in 1986).
Disaster was averted by the skin of their teeth. Nothing went as the public was assured it would.
And? It was averted, nobody was hurt, they took steps to make sure nothing like it ever happened again--and nothing like it has.
Nope. Just nope. A dumb idea waiting to happen with unintended consequences lurking everywhere.
Someone needs to forward this Tweet to Elon Musk over at SpaceX 😩
Speaking of the "thermostat" topic, I feel like I should point out that there's basically a "=" between "cold northern climates" and "wealthy Western nations" - the exceptions amount to like Russia and Greenland and caveats are still needed for both.
Also, as a Finn let me tell you we're not actually super happy about global warming up here. The rising temperatures are already causing all *kinds* of issues large and small and even the most uninformed urbanite is at least vaguely aware that the summers are really starting to get unpleasantly hot and proper snowy winters an increasingly rare beast.
And if the really bad feedback loops like serious polar ice retreat (potentially leading to the Gulf Stream going titsup), Arctic permafrost thaw (releasing stupid amounts of trapped CO2 and methane and whatnot) and what have you start kicking in?
Ain't nobody having fun *anywhere*, inclusive the short-sighted nitwits presently ecstatic over the prospects of commercially navigable Northwest and Northeat Passages, and the postglacial rebound of our Nordic coastlines sure as heck isn't going to outpace the rising sea levels.
I’m hoping she will be as big a pain in his ass as she was ever in anyone’s.
As always: well said. Geoscientist checking in.
dis ho? (Georgia Howler...)
https://www.democracyonhospice.com/p/the-georgia-howlers-guide-to-factual
I love your work. Having said that, I don’t love this piece. You decry one thing, cloud seeding to stimulate rainfall into drought-stricken areas, and then, to support your trepidation around using that process, you talk about something completely different, reflecting heat back into space to alleviate warming.
Ooooh no, I don't have a problem with cloud seeding for rain, although there's no real evidence it works consistently (boooo!). And even though MTG is using that as a red herring, that's not really what she's talking about in her bill.
Remember, Republicans deny climate change even exists and therefore deny that we need to address it in any way. Florida has made it illegal to even pass laws to have mitigation efforts. That's what MTG is doing here, although in this case, she happens to be right but for the wrong reasons.
Cloud seeding for rain is small-scale and local. MTG is explicitly talking about climate-level efforts, which cloud seeding for rain is not. Although I understand what you're saying.
Ok. The segue from cloud seeding to more elaborate and fraught forms of geoengineering like the “space mirrors” wasn’t evident to me on first read. BTW we probably have effective space mirrors coming anyway with the space Nazi’s (and others entering that area) surveillance satellites. As always, the south african “genius” is probably taking a hammer to his own dick by short circuiting his impossible mars colony dream (no gravitational field=no atmosphere = no colony), assuming he could get his big boy rockets to not blow up on the pad, by creating so much orbital debris that nothing can get into space anyway. On 2nd thought, he probably doesn’t care as he’ll get paid anyway. Carry on with the god’s work you’re doing!
The rich irony is this: The fossil fuel industry (coal, petroleum, etc.) have been "geoengineering" for centuries, but without acknowledging it. Every ton of fossil fuel that is burned injects an exponentially greater amount of greenhouse gasses and particulate into the atmosphere.
As MTG so astutely observes, that "injection, release, or dispersion of chemicals and substances into the atmosphere" is exactly the problem, however it is not a matter of "cloud seeding", it is just business as usual. The only missing factor is an announcement of an "express purpose of altering weather, temperature, climate, or sunlight intensity."
Frankly, if one operates machinery or equipment in a manner that a reasonable person should have known is likely to cause harm, even if not intending the harm, that person may be legally liable for the unintended outcome.
Will the purveyors and promoters of fossil fuels be locked up if MTG's fantasy makes their emissions a felony?
One can only hope.
“It’s gross. It’s vile. Fuck every last one of these soulless monsters with a 2x4 covered in spliters until they beg for the sweet release of death.”
…covered in splinters, rusty nails, and shards of broken beer bottles….